LinuxSA Mailing list archives

  From: David Lloyd <lloy0076@rebel.net.au>
  To  : Stephen Ward <sward@trinity.sa.edu.au>
  Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 16:19:03 +0930

Re: MS Curriculum at schools and TAFEs ...

Stephen et al!

> I have followed this tortuous thread with some interest, and at times marvelled at
> the 'catfight' it seems to have engendered. Contributor 'Mark' is our network
> manager and a Linux / Solaris devotee - and a fine one at that!

There is no "catfight". It's a group of people having a robust
discussion.

> it or not, MS provided the impetus for the PC framework onto which most educational
> software has attached itself, and there are many fine products - almost an infinite
> supply at increasingly competitive prices.

I thought Apple were there before Microsoft but I may be wrong. When I
first saw computers in schools there were Apple ]['s and Commodore 64's.

> The move to Linux etc. appears to have moved us some steps backwards, despite the
> supposed 'low cost'.

For thirty years there's been an operating system that has run
seamlessly and without too many grand flaws. It just runs. You don't
hear the "HP-UX just crashed again", or the "SOLARIS lost all my data".
There's a saying that I saw somewhere "Why throw away 30 year's
experience?".

> We now have to employ full-time network managers, and the
> ability for the teacher to have a key role in running (or intergering with) systems
> becomes increasingly remote.

Full time network managers are a boon to any system - Novell, NT,
Windows 2000, LanTastic, Linux or whatever. The "install the network
once" and it will "never need touching again" is just not true. For any
current operating system. Furthermore, since when do system
administrators or network managers stop teachers/staff/people who use
the system from helping to run the system.

The whole point of having logon's and users is so the network staff can
allow users to customise their logons to their heart's contents. Are you
seriously advocating the "every teacher has an NT Administrator account
and can do the `what happens if I put C: in the trash can' trick"? I'd
hazard a bet that in schools where there are no network managers that
there are a few teachers who - for whatever reason - might know more
than the others and they're the ones who keep the system running.

Oops, did I add "network management" to their job description?

> Morover, the network manager may have a very different
> perspective of the network and technical priorities compared to the teacher in the
> classroom.

Are you saying there is a breakdown in communication in school systems?
Are you saying that system administrators are wholly unable to work with
their users to create a network that provides a solution to the users
needs? If you look at any IT course that isn't totally technically
based, you'll see things like:

* communication
* gathering user needs
* working with users
* creating documentation

I agree that the network manager "may". I don't agree with your implied
the network manager "will"...

> We sometimes seem to be moving into 'computing for computing's sake'
> rather than focussing on the needs of the end-user.

Sometimes. Not now.

> Linux is not easy to use.

Oh dear! We have to learn something...

> The mnemonic jargon which fills this list is evidence of
> that.

What mnemonic jargon? Have you suddenly forgotten that this is a Linux
support list and people who understand the jargon speak on it?

> OK, so network managers will look after all the background tasks, but, at the
> end of the day, where is the software support? The Gimp, Star Office, Logo (and a
> multitude of banner-choked net sites) may be fine, but DTP, conventional (non-java)
> programming, CD-ROM resources, CAD, and general K-12 curriculum support seem to be
> poorly served.

You've got the "desktop" versus "server" confused here. "gcc" supports
ANSI C and has reasonable support for ANSI C++ (well, it does C++ but
I'm not savvy enough to know how "conformist" it is). What CD-ROM
resources? Have you even bothered to look at http://freshmeat.net/ for
CAD?

Incidentally, I'm not in the education field and I don't know what DTP
is... [read: don't accuse me of talking mnemonic gibberish when you're
doing the same yourself].

> Could someone please 'put me right' and point me to some resources. Once the server
> is up, and protected by its firewall, chatting to its clients and showering them
> with easy email and net access, what are students in schools going to be doing
> other than sending each other silly messages and cruising the net?

Learning. Funny that, eh? Incidentally, what's wrong with sending each
other "silly messages"? And are you prepared to argue that "cruising the
net [sic: it should be 'net] disbenefits students" when it's slowly
becoming obvious that a new class of illiterates are emerging - the
information technology illiterate?

DSL

**is feeling particularly pedantic at the moment**

-- 
Dodos are birds that are extinct
 - Quoted by D.S.L. 16 April 2001

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