LinuxSA Mailing list archives

  From: Michael Davies <michaeld@senet.com.au>
  To  : David Lloyd <lloy0076@rebel.net.au>
  Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:13:52 +1030

Re: Meeting Speaker Proposal

David Lloyd wrote:
> I think you mean "technical talks" as opposed to "non-technical talks".

Not exactly.  Last year we had the Playford Centre present, and to be honest
that was interesting.  That was "non-technical" but not a waste of (my) time.

> Given this statement:
> 
> > Sure, politics has it's place.  That place may include LinuxSA sometimes.  But
> > if it does, I'm not very interested.  As per usual, just IMHO.
> 
> I would assume that you are not against politics as a subject.

Not as a subject, no.  As a LinuxSA meeting topic, I don't think it's
worthwhile.

> Government policies can and do influence the work we do, the programs we
> use and the type of people we can expect to emply. Our current
> Government's policy appears to favour a closed source, initially - and
> possibly continually - expensive operating system. Furthermore, students
> leaving school may not be taught the fundamentals of computing science
> but only know how to use a possibly obsolete set of packages in an
> office environment.

This has nothing to do with the "current" government as opposed to governments
in general that make policy from individuals that get convinced by marketers
who accept trinkets from big companies to lock in to a supplier.  Technical
merit is typically only a small part of the equation[1]

> Even outside of computer science we can see this happening. Students
> need to be taught (again) how to communicate and how to write essays;
> how to study. Yet they've spent up to 12 years of their life supposedly
> learning these types of things. I've studied some older mathematical
> exams and older English examinations (like 30 to 40 years' ago) and, in
> my opinion, matriculation students then studied the same material that
> 1st year undergraduates study now.

This may all be true, and for the record I agree, but it isn't linux related. 
If I want to discuss various systems and ideologies I'll grab my copy of "On
Dit", sit on the Barr Smith lawns and philosophise with the enlightened around
me like I did while at uni.

If I go to LinuxSA I want to talk about linux.

> To pace my analogies outside of the Australian context. If the U.S.A.
> Department of Defense (DoD) announces that it will support only ADA-95
> (2) and no longer support ANSI C this will and does make a huge shift on
> companies, their staffs and the expertise they need. If the DoD suddenly
> decided that all operating systems must be Open Source, the need for
> expert Linux, FreeBSD and other Open Source skilled people in America
> would increase out of hand - especially as President Bush II looks like
> he's going to increase DoD's budget.

The DoD already experimented with mandation and software and it didn't work. 
Likewise the SA government will find out the same with The Contract.  We
needn't do anything for this discovery to be found out.

> I agree that LinuxSA is not a political group, nor is it a lobby group.
> I am suggesting that we invite the Minister for Information Services -
> and perhaps his Shadow counterparts but not necessarily all at the same
> time - to speak to us about:
> 
> * general Government policy
> * views, thoughts, what is the Government's vision
> * programs, bodies that can provide support to the Open Source Community

And with this any commitment for change?  Obviously no.  How will this impact
the way that linux has spread so far (that is, grassroots, one-on-one)?  It
won't.  Linux has done well not because of marketing, but because of freedom
and technical superiority over closed-source equivalents.

> Whilst I'm certain the Minister would speak eloquently - I would expect
> no less - I'm sure that we would make certain there is enough time for
> questions, queries and discussion with the users of Linux and other Open
> Source operating systems.
> 
> I assure you - and everyone - that my thoughts on proposing this matter
> was to help and promote the Open Source Community in a non-political,
> collaborative manner. I never suggested that we stage this as a "lobby"
> style meeting, but instead a meeting where we can all get together in a
> relatively informal session and learn about each other.

I understand that was your intent.  I just don't see it achieving anything for
either group, and wastes our regular monthly timeslot when we could be
celebrating our software freedom!

> If we are able to institute change and have more support for Open Source
> from within the Government, to gain better skilled graduates (from
> matric and/or university) whom we don't have to train _again_ in
> Unix/Linux/BSD et al it will be to our benefit.

We can never out do the marketers.  We can only sell our technical benefits
(and hence the financial benefits) to governments and big business.  If we
compete at the level of glossy brouchures and trinkets I don't think we can
win.  If we focus right there's no doubt we will win!  

Michael...

[1] Working in defence taught me this.

-- 
Michael Davies         "Do what you think is interesting, do something that
michaeld@senet.com.au   you think is fun and worthwhile, because otherwise 
                        you won't do it well anyway."  -- Brian Kernighan.

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