LinuxSA Mailing list archives

  From: Daniel Callan <dcallan@dataline.net.au>
  To  : Mark Newton <newton@atdot.dotat.org>
  Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 16:50:04 +1000

Re: Opinions on New Internet Bill (While I am still allowed to

Hi Mark,

At 14:49 27/05/99 +0930, you wrote:
>Firstly, there's no such thing as snuff films.  Any politician who
>claims they're a problem is only showing his own ignorance.

Yeah, I know, they're a bit of an urban myth ;-)
Sorry, I really just meant the stuff politicians refer to, like
downright gory/offensive content (eg: gore archives with stuff taken
from "Dan's Gallery of the Grotesque" before it got taken down...by the
author himself). Point I was making was simply that the SERIOUSLY BAD
content is mostly hidden away in the quieter hollows of the net.
Not sitting on popular HTTP sex-sites (which, I believe, are the 
only targets here).

> > If it became an INTERNATIONAL law/agreement, then there would
> > be a whole lot less "oh but that's within THEIR juristriction"
> > crap and they would have to hide in the few nations left that
> > bauk extraditions and such. They currently use the internationalism
> > of the Internet for safety from prosecution. So let's turn it against 
> > them by making it the same law wherever they are.
>
>Secondly, this has already happened.  There is nowhere in the world
>where kiddyporn is tolerated.  Police have been cooperating internationally
>on this for years before the internet even existed, and ISPs worldwide
>remove it where they find it.  There have been several successful 
>prosecutions in Australia for distributing child pornography on the
>net, which just goes to show that existing laws were working.

Quite true. I wasn't actually sure if it was permanent and well established
(not to mention financed) yet. But I did hear about those operations
last year (busting the "Wonderland Club" or something similar wasn't it?).

However, I was more refering to an actual international organisation,
kinda like the UN (bad example I know ;-) which then co-ordinates
and directs the cooperative efforts of all these police forces.
And not just porn, I'm talking about setting up an organisation with
technically-minded, well-informed specialists who act like
Internet "Marshalls". Not because I love the idea of regulation or
censorship; but purely to pre-empt stupid 'stop-gap' legislation
getting forced into effect by the moral majority (who understand
practically nothing about the technical nuances of the problem
they wish to rememdy). I mean, the official documents of this new
law probably still have liquid-paper over the "must display warning
sticker on outside plastic packaging..." sections from when it was
originally the film/literature clasification laws document ;-P

So, I wasn't saying they hadn't done it at all, just not enough,
and not as ONE mighty organisation/body.

>
>It is a fallacy to say the Internet is unregulated, and the fallacy
>is generally only promulgated by those who have a vested interest
>in increasing the regulation.  Restrictions on banned erotica, terrorism,
>and incitements to violence have always been illegal in all media, including
>the Internet.
>

I didn't mean unregulated. I just meant that it can/could be a potential
juristrictional nightmare, IF there ARE any countries that don't want
to play ball with each of the other countries involved. 
(There is no one head to the beast, if you know what I mean ;-)

Anyway, I said it sounded utopian ;-P (albeit slightly inacurate too),
just anything is better than insisting that the net regress to a senario
that suits our paper-based censorship system (ie: list it, ban it).
Many man-hours chewed in just making/maintaining the list too.

<sarcasm> Hey, now there's a job that the 'work-for-dole' mob wouldn't
knock back: trauling the net for porn to block.  heheheheh </sarcasm>


Cheers,
-Daniel

PS: I in no way work in the area of international law enforcement,
so bear with me if my 2c worth is in any way niaeve or just wrong ;-)

         Daniel Callan
        System Engineer/
       Senior Programmer

     hostmaster@dataline.net.au
      -- DataLine.net.au --
     http://dataline.net.au 

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